Accountability and transparency within our institutions and leadership.
posted by jewishwhistleblower @ 3:04 PM
http://www.rabbis.org/news/article.cfm?id=100592Supplementary Statement on Rabbi Mordecai Tendler Apr 19, 2005 -- A Further Statement by the Rabbinical Council of America in the Matter of Rabbi Mordecai TendlerWe wish to thank Rav Chaim Rosenthal, Av Bet Din of the Bet Din Ha-Ezori of Jerusalem, for his clarification (dated 5 Nissan 5765) of the earlier preliminary opinion (hachlatah, which is a preliminary opinion, not a psak or decision) of the Bet Din Ha-Ezori. We have read both the hachlatah and his letter to us very carefully, and therefore we wish to make the following statement:Although the Rabbinical Council of America feels that this is an internal membership issue, nonetheless, because of our respect for the Gedolim in Eretz Yisrael, we wish to clarify that(cont)
1. The Rabbinical Council of America, in responding to complaints brought to it regarding Rabbi Mordecai Tendler, acted in all respects in accordance with its established constitutional provisions to review his membership status in our organization.2. The Rabbinical Council of America has acted only in regard to his membership in our organization, and has not addressed his employment in his congregation or elsewhere. 3. The matter of his employment remains entirely up to the members of his congregation, and is not under our jurisdiction.Therefore we are in harmony with the opinion of the Bet Din Ha-Ezori, as clarified by its Av Bet Bin. For the record, anyone wishing to see the texts of the original hachlata and the subsequent clarification by the Av Bet Din, may see them on the website of the Rabbinical Council of America, at www.rabbis.org.
If anyone would like to translate, please feel free to post here. Prelimenary translation is OK as we'll correct it in the comments and repost if necessary.
"Significant Defeat for the Rabbi Mordechai Tendler"It is interesting that JWB can already declare this a "significant defeat" for RMT when JWB is incapable of translating the documents for himself (hence his request for someone else to translate it for him).If you read the documents, you will see that this is a victory for RMT as well. Read the 2nd page of the 2nd PDF file and you will see.
The 1st document(http://www.rabbis.org/news/_pdfs/Hachlatah%201.pdf )was printed in English in the Jewish Press last week in English.(Jewish Press translation)DECISIONSTATE OF ISRAELJerusalem Regional Bet DinCase No: 900008858-53-1Date: 25 Adar II 576505 April 2005Plaintiff: Rabbi Mordechai TendlerNumber: 900008858Defendant: Rabbinical Council of America, et al.Number: 900008859Matter:Other Orders Before the Honorable Judges:Rabbi Matityahu Shrem, Chief JudgeRabbi Chaim S. Rosenthal, JudgeRabbi C.Y. Rabinovitz, JudgeA request for an Injunction was presented to this court.(cont)
A review of the materials presented in this case clarified that the Plaintiff and Defendants do not reside in Eretz Yisrael. In response to the inquiry of this Court regarding the connection of this matter to the Court of Jerusalem, the attorney for the Plaintiff explained that there is no rabbinic authority in the United States in which the R.C.A. is subjugated; however, all rabbis of the Diaspora are subjugated to the Batei Din of the State of Israel, because “From Zion shall Torah go forth.”(cont)
This is particularly so with respect to the Rabbinical Council of America, R.C.A., inasmuch as the R.C.A. has stated publicly that the organization stands behind the decisions of the Chief Rabbinate of Israel and considers itself as partner with the Chief Rabbinate of Israel.This court convened, and after reviews of the materials presented to the Court, this Court hereby agrees with the request of the Plaintiff and hereby orders that the Defendants are prohibited from damaging or in anyway affecting any services provided by, or any status or position of, the Plaintiff unless and until the Defendants summon the Plaintiff to a Din Torah, in any location in the world, before an official rabbinical Ben Din or before a Bet Din constituted through the process of “zablah”.(cont)
Given this 25th day of Adar II, 5795 (05 April, 2005)Matityahu Shrem, Chief JudgeChaim S. Rosenthal, JudgeC.Y. Rabinovitz, JudgeCertified copy of original Decision[SEAL OF JERUSALEM REGIONAL BET DIN]Moshe Biton [Stamp of Binyamin Shunam, Asst. Chief Clerk, Jerusalem Regional Bet Din]Chief Clerk
>It is interesting that JWB can >already declare this >a "significant defeat" for RMT >when JWB is incapable of >translating the documents for >himself (hence his request for >someone else to translate it for >him).I just don't have time to translate. Feel free to do so if you want.
JWB is definitely not Gary "Gadi" Pickholz, as someone had claimed on the previous thread. Gadi knows Hebrew. JWB does not (as evidenced above).
>I just don't have time to translate. >Feel free to do so if you want.Yeah, right. You have time to run this blog 24/7, and yet you don't have time to translate a 3 page document containing only 12 sentences of text. Give me a break.
2nd document:STATE OF ISRAELJerusalem Regional Bet DinJerusalem, 5 Nissan 5765Decision:In the name of the Bet Din, I am responding to the letter of the honorable Rabbis ...(someone else finish as I do not have time, but yes I know Hebrew)
>Yeah, right. You have time to >run this blog 24/7, and yet you >don't have time to translate a 3 >page document containing only 12 >sentences of text. Give me a >break. So you do it. I'm in the middle of several things and can only give my partial attention to this blog.
>So you do it. I'm in the middle of >several things and can only give my >partial attention to this blog.12 sentences would take JWB all day with his Alkalai Hebrew-English dictionary.
You're welcome to prove your Hebrew proficiency. 2 1/2 typed Hebrew pages. Clock starts now.
The clarification to which you refer clearly forbids any action which is likely to cause a dismissal. It is obvious that expulsion from the RCA would fall into that catagory. The only exception they left was for an action which would have no connection to a Rabbinical position. The RCA is trying to miscontrue their actions into that exception, but it just doesn't hold water.
>Yeah, right. You have time to >run this blog 24/7I can only run this blog "24/5 and 23/1" because of Shabbos (and of course festivals which alter things).You RMT supporters here are so reckless with shmirat halashon.
>The RCA is trying to miscontrue >their actions into that >exception, but it just doesn't >hold water. Your unsupported opinion.
"You RMT supporters here are so reckless with shmirat halashon."Whoa. If that isn't ironic, then I don't know what is.
>>The RCA is trying to miscontrue>>their actions into that>>exception, but it just doesn't>>hold water.>Your unsupported opinion.And yet you seem to think that your title "Significant Defeat..." is any better?Perhaps if JWB knew Hebrew, he'd have a clue.
"Dovor ho'olul ligrom" means a thing which is likely to cause. The connotation of "ligrom" is actually to cause in an indirect manner"
"Your unsupported opinion."Actually, his comment has plenty of support in the Bet Din HaEzori document itself. I am sure that the Jewish Press will give proper accounting of this matter (along with a translation so that JWB can actually read the latest document).
JWB SMACKED AGAIN!!!Read the Jewish Voice and Opinion!!!OMG, this finally tells the story in COMPLETE detail and blows JWB aka teaneck gary out of the water.My ferevent hope is that you and luke ford get your ass sued in civil court.
>The connotation of "ligrom" is >actually to cause in an indirect >manner"Your explanation of ligrom is correct. The Rabbanut's wording favors RMT, since the RCA has indirectly caused RMT to lose his position at YU. The RCA can be held accountable, even if this was not their direct intention (which is debatable).
See http://www.thejewishweek.com/news/newscontent.php3?artid=10672&offset=&B1=1&author=Debra%20Nussbaum%20Cohen&issuedates=manydays&month=04&day=14&year=2005&issuedate=20041019&keyword=tendlerwherein it states:The impact of the expulsion on Rabbi Tendler’s professional standing, beyond no longer having membership in the RCA, remains to be seen. While Orthodox synagogues are not required to hire rabbis who are members of the denominations’ allied rabbinical groups, being barred from the RCA will make it difficult for him to find work as a congregational rabbi elsewhere, some officials said. In Rabbi Tendler’s community, the impact of his expulsion was felt immediately. Sources close to the synagogue, Kehillat New Hempstead, which is near Monsey in Rockland County, said that other rabbis who had been teaching adult education classes there immediately began boycotting the congregation as a result of the RCA decision. The synagogue is said to be divided between loyalists and critics, and has lost some families since the charges against the rabbi became known. Sources there said the congregation may not be able to formally fire Rabbi Tendler, who they said has a lifetime contract and whose family donated much of the money used to build the synagogue. It seems fairly clear that the RCA's actions were designed to affect RMT's job status. At the very least such an effect would be reasonably foreseeable. The RCA makes no sense at all
“Although the Rabbinical Council of America feels that this is an internal membership issue, nonetheless.…”The women who had the courage to go to the RCA did not go because the RCA should get rid of their member, rather this being the process to rid this Rabbi from a position representing the Rabbinate who is committing sexual misconduct. Shame on you RCA for not being vocal that his rabbinical abuse and all rabbinical abuse has to stop. This is more then an internal membership issue.“3. The matter of his employment remains entirely up to the members of his congregation, and is not under our jurisdiction.”Shame on you RCA for endeavoring in the Plaintiffs claim! You wouldn’t go out of your way to clarify your reasons for Expulsion so that there would be no doubt for debate because you are scared of legal ramifications. God help the women to sue you for this statement. You, the RCA, and all his supporters and KNH, are now responsible if he has 5 more girls at age 15 pick up their dresses because “its entirely up to his members” who love love him no matter what. You are all responsible if but one more women gets victimized. No, he should not be a congregational Rabbi.“Therefore we are in harmony with the opinion of the Bet Din Ha-Ezori, as clarified by its Av Bet Bin….….the attorney for the Plaintiff explained that there is no rabbinic authority in the United States in which the R.C.A. is subjugated; however, all rabbis of the Diaspora are subjugated to the Batei Din of the State of Israel, because “From Zion shall Torah go forth.”What?The RCA complying has now given false credence with the inaccurate claim that all rabbis of the Diaspora are subjugated… What? This is now being tested with RMT, the RCA, America Diaspora, and used here, what egos, by this Beit Din as being the Authority? Why is No one in the Jewish world questioning that this has never been stated before? Tested before? And not voted by the Jewish people as them being that authority? If any Beit Din Torah is allowed to exist as authority? And not only have that, who pick this beit dinned? RMT. Did they review the materials, as they claimed? No! Liars. So no, liars aren’t allowed in a true Torah Beit Din. Did they see, have a “trial” of both sides? No. There is no Authority. Now this beit Din wants to claim they have it over anyone outside of Israel? Let us vote. There is no authority. There is no centralized beit din. Victims of RMT for years and supporters were trying to find some authority to do something and stop him. Many other victims of rabbinical abuse have been trying to find an authority to stop it. There is no Sanhedrin.Oh the RMT gets legal points that he caught the RCA in some twisted legal claim that,“This is particularly so with respect to the Rabbinical Council of America, R.C.A., in as much as the R.C.A. has stated publicly that the organization stands behind the decisions of the Chief Rabbinate of Israel and considers itself as partner with the Chief Rabbinate of Israel.” Partners as showing unity, perhaps as colleges, advisors. No claim to authority as the RCA does not go to them in all decisions. No legal doctrine that all decisions are passed through the Chief Rabbinate. Where has the Chief Rabbinate or the RCA make claims that all decisions, investigations and determination, etc, is determined by the Chief Rabbinate? The issue being that this all a ridiculous whitewashing turn of events that you have made into a losing and false jargon of legal sounding phrases. The issue is RMT is abusing his position as Rabbi and committing sexual misconduct. He is pursuing, manipulating and sexually harassing women.You have to stop him now. You have to stop this kind of abuse in our Jewish Torah communities. “This court convened, and after reviews of the materials presented to the Court, this Court hereby agrees with the request of the Plaintiff and hereby orders that the Defendants are prohibited from damaging or in anyway affecting any services provided by, or any status or position of, the Plaintiff unless and until the Defendants summon the Plaintiff to a Din Torah, in any location in the world, before an official rabbinical Ben Din or before a Bet Din constituted through the process of “zablah”. What double talk. The Chief rabbinate sites the Plaintiff, that there is no rabbinic authority in the United States and concludes that they are the authority because they are in Jerusalem telling the RCA what to do and authorizing that the determination is not valid until the Defendants summon the Plaintiff to a Din Torah any location in the world. They just said no beit din is accepted but them. Well if they are now double talking and saying that the defendants can summon…through….Then the women have. They went to a rabbinical authority, the RCA. You the Chief Rabbinate and the Plaintiffs quoted the RCA as being partners with the Chief Rabbinate of Israel”. Thus they are an authority and concluded he is guilty.
my Hebrew is excellent, and having read the hachlatot, the beis din in Israel has backed the RCA on its finding that conduct unbecoming a rabbi was within its domain, and that no further activity is required INCLUDING any further complaint suggesting any wrongdoing by RMT.The ONLY equation in which those two add up, despite the desperate spin doctoring of BOTH sides in this debate, is voluntary adultery.The RCA had it right all along, and deserves everyone's apology.These women were never victims of any kind, and RMT engaged in an activity (with at least one woman who stepped forward and voluntarily testified to a long standin relationship) in conduct unbecoming an orthodox rabbi, requiring his expulsion.Both sides are wrong in their claims and spin. RMT is not innocent, and there never was any abuse.You now have BOTH the RCA and the beis din in Israel proclaiming this.As no one else here will admit to this basic fact, let me extend what will likely be the ONLY kol hakavod to Rabbis Billet, Herring Schwarts et al at the RCA who weeded through mounds of terrible testimonies and saw through the fact that all parties were lying. Absolutely everyone in this sordid affair (literally) is guilty.And now the beis din in Israel concurs with the RCA.
I want to take issue with the statement that the women were not victims at all. Granted, if they engaged in voluntary sex with RMT, they were over the age of consent and must bear responsbility. However, might it not be reasonably argued that when a Rav uses his position to seduce women, under the pretense that it is halachically correct, professes his love for the women and then "dumps" them, are the women not in some sense a victim of a rabbinical cad?
1. Will the Tendler-Feinstein camp come out against the Israeli bet din?2. Will the RCA publish its info?3. Will both sides tone down the rhetoric and do what is right?4. Who will stand up for emes and rid us of this Chilul HaShem?5. Will rebitzen Tendler see the truth?6. Who are the real victims?But first a word from our sponsor! Have you heard from Satan today? Have you heaped enough scorn on the Torah?...
I'd like to see The Jewish Press report this latest development.
This whole fatuation is a waste of time. We now know for sure that he is innocent,so why to drag it out?If those women insist on their claims,they must get a devorce and move unwards. Why waste so much emotion on this subject.Oh yes, you women out there,be careful from now on from the ISSUR of Yichud.If you were not,you have only yourselves to blame.
stay tuned for a complete translation of the actual statement. Some of you will be suprised at what it actually says.
"my Hebrew is excellent, and having read the hachlatot, the beis din in Israel has backed the RCA on its finding that conduct unbecoming a rabbi was within its domain, and that no further activity is required INCLUDING any further complaint suggesting any wrongdoing by RMT."As an interested outsider (I find this whole thing fascinating), what I don't understand is how the RCA maintains that it is/was an internal matter. It seems that is what the Beit Din is currently supporting. The facts seem to indicate otherwise. The RCA leaked the investigation to the press (Forward and Jewish Week) and Rabbi Auman was even interviewed while the investigation was going on. YU fired RMT on the basis of the RCA's decision. Given that being a member of the RCA is not a prerequisite to teaching at YU, it is clear that the decision has had direct external impact the extent to which is yet to be determined. By definition, it was never just an internal matter. I simply do not understand the logic in the way the decision is being explained here (my Hebrew is not good enough to translate directly). The RCA's new statement and the translation being given here does not jive with the facts.
so are these women going to dare come to shul and sit next to me and my daughters on yuntif? Next to Michelle, after they had adultress affairs with her husband?Will they expect us to remain silent, waiting for their next infatuation with somebody's husband?where are our men to do the required right thing in the name of the community?Appalled KNH Wife and Mother
Appalled KNH Wife and Mother:If you continue to maintain RMT's guilt in adulterous affairs, some proof would be in order. Nice try, though. Are you by any chance one of the midwives posting here?
I am not addressing Rabbi Tendler's role at all...perhaps I am the only one not addressing his role. He continues to deny his role and is entitled to whatever legal procedure is appropriate, to its conclusion.I am addressing sitting next to women who have admitted to adultry with a man in the community. They are not denying their actions, and my skin crawls every time they sit down next to us in shul.What is everyone waiting for regarding them? This isn't the outcome the Tendler enemies hoped for? Who cares? It seems all of you are guilty on all sides, if I now understand properly, but the Rabbi is entitled to the benefit of the dwindling doubt until the end of the legal process. Not a woman who stands up and shouts she had an affair with my girlfriend's husband and then sits down next to my daughter in shul like some heroine!And next year it will open season on my man? And the community should applaud her for this? Forget about it.Appalled KNH Wife and Mother
"I am addressing sitting next to women who have admitted to adultry with a man in the community."There has been so such admission. Repeating the same lie over and over does not make it true. It appears that you are JWB's wife (or at least his intellectual equal) - or perhaps even JWB himself (since he is known to post here under multiple names to suit his needs).
This is hysterical.What the Beis Din says is as follows (summed up quickly):1) We highly respect Rabbi J.B. Soloveichik, and are not biased against the RCA2) We greatly love the Talmidim of zrav Soloveichik and are not biased against the RCA.3) We still uphold our psak that you need to go to a Beis Din to work this out.4) If throwing Rav Tendler out of the RCA has no impact on his employment as a Rav, then your actions in throwing him out of the RCA do not need to be brought before a Beis Din.Nowhere do they write that they changed their minds. The only new issue is point #4- does membership in the RCA have an impact on Rav Tendlers position. As Rav Tendler brought the Din Torah based upon the Halachah that you cannot arbitrarily throw a Rav out of his position as a Rav, if that is not the case with the RCA, then there is no reason for the Din Torah.The Rabbanut did not say anything at all about the guilt of Rav Tendler, or anything at all that might be a 'significant defeat' for Rav Tendler.JWB - Learn some rabinnic Hebrew, and learn the nuances of letters that Rabbis write. It will get you much further than writing dirt on a blog.
It says clearly that the RCA should not make any moves that are irreversible and may cause a Rabbi to be fired.I think that Rav Tendler won this round - as being thrown out of the RCA may definitely cost him his job as a Rabbi.
To Appalled KNH Wife-There are at least 7 shuls in New Hempstead. 95% of people at KNH live closer to a different shul, but choose to walk farther to attend KNH, and I assume that you do too.So, if you don't like the people who sit around you, join a different shul. There are plenty of other places to go.Of course, all of the above assumes that you actually live in New Hempstead and attend KNH. Given the amount of lies around here, I would not be surprised if you have never even stepped foot in KNH.Appalled KNH Husband
"2) We greatly love the Talmidim of Rav Soloveichik"As a point of interest, RMT attended the Rav's shiur at YU for many years, and RMT is a nephew of the Rav (the Rav and Rav Moshe Feinstein were first cousins once removed). So, RMT is one of the talmidim that the Bais Din "loves".
"This whole fatuation is a waste of time. We now know for sure that he is innocent,so why to drag it out?"Which planet do you live on- many many people have known his guilt, many more know it know- eventually all (who are willing ot see the truth) will. What are you talking about?? nt, dbs, eric... can't even open their mouths without a lie comming out- and these are the people (or the voice and press etc. printing their lies) that you put your trust in???give me a break!!!
so now we know from both the RCA and the most important beis din in the world that BOTH the Rabbi and his accusers have been lying to us all along and BOTH have played us for complete fools.Meawhile, KNH has been turned into the laughingstock of all world jewry, except no one is laughing. We have been played for FOOLS by both sides who were each simply advancing their agendas at our expense!
Who is this Rabbi Mordecai Tendler who thinks it's OK for an orthodox rabbi to have sexual relations with many women, especially after he is married?Who is this Mordechai Tendler who thinks it's OK to counsel women and seduce them into having an affair with him?Who is this Mordecai Tendler who believes it's OK to use extortion to manipulate women who want to get a Get. When is it OK for an orthodox rabbi to use his power and control over someone needing help?Who in their right mind would want to be a part of a community who would shun women or anyone for stepping forward and turning in an individual like Mordecai Tendler. We should be given them all an award for bravery. A community that would turn their backs on those who blow the whistle should be shunned. They should never be considered a representative of the Jewish people.
Who is this JWB who thinks it's OK for a blogger to hide behind an anonymous blog and spread lies and rumors?Who is this JWB who thinks it's OK to delete the posts of people who disagree with him?Who is this JWB who thinks it's OK to delete his old posts to hide lies when he is caught?Who is this JWB who thinks it's OK to post under multiple names to further his slimy agenda?
1. When Jews turn their backs on Eretz Yisrael, and thinking its frummer to live in KNH, Teaneck and Monsey -- its no surprise this happens.2. Authentic Rabbinic Leadership is so weak today, its no surprise any of the above is happening. 3. Move to Gush Katif; its alot more meaningful than participating in a Desperate Jewish Housewives reality episode in KNH. My friends and I here could not believe this entire blog. We're fighting hourly for our homes and land -- and this blog reads like a pathetic soap opera.4. See you at the Beit HaMikdash on Motzei Shabbat. Korban Pesach is coming email@example.com
Rediculous comment of the month award winner is:in response to :"I am addressing sitting next to women who have admitted to adultry with a man in the community."the winning rediculous remark of the month is: "There has been so such admission. Repeating the same lie over and over does not make it true."So now you have the audacity to ask me to tell my girls that these women, in fact, are backtracking and now deny publicly and repeatedly admitting to the most vulgar forms of adultry ---for lengthy periods of time, mind you, not one fleeting indiscretion!!!!I may be the ONLY one here actually from KNH. My husband and I paid enormous funds and tzedaka to build the shul, as well as time and effort, and now people are trying to backpeddle on admitted adultry to stay inside?My skin crawls at the thought of thes harlots being permitted into shul. They have admitted to adultry. Where are the men in the community to do the right thing and enforce cherem? You are correct, there are 7 other shuls here -- they can go elsewhere. How dare some two-timing harlot suggest to me that MY FAMILY go elsewhere because she blabbed to the world that she slept (and a WHOLE lot more than that) with a girlfriend's husband.Not how she expected things to turn out? tough cookies, slut.TIme for us all to be much less Modern and much more Orthodox about this. Today.
the bottom line, folks, is that we have all be had...both the beis din of Israel and the RCA have clearly concluded that both sides here ewre lying all along, for their own power motivations.And we have been made into truly the fools of all Judaism by both sides.For this I poured a fortune in this community as well as this shul. What a fool I was. What fools we have all been, financing and supporting both sets of liars.
she blabbed to the world that she slept (and a WHOLE lot more than that) with a girlfriend's husband.Is this confirmed that she is referring to MT of NH? Are you sure that its true? If its true, how can we keep him as our Rabbi? I won't be able to look him straight in the face without laughing.
>tough cookies, slutBased on the type of comments you post here, I am quite certain that few will miss you at KNH. Your vulgarity belongs elsewhere.Many of the posters here are daily participants in KNH. Many of us put lots of time and money into the shul as well. Why do you think that you are so high-and-mighty and can claim to have a corner on the market of committment to KNH?If you are so active in KNH then you would know that the vast majority of shul participants (daily or weekly) support Rabbi Tendler - until someone comes forward with some actual proof that he did anything wrong. If you have verifiable proof, then come forward. KNH members only want the truth. If you have it and make it public, you will be welcomed and praised. Otherwise, don't let the door hit you on your way out.[Based on your choice of words and your description of your family, I am quite certain of your identity (and others may be as well). If you want to remain anonymous, I suggest that you exercise more caution. If you request, I'll provide some subtle clues for confirmation.]
Kol Hakavod to the anonymus who posted 8.28AM.For us, here in Israel, it's unbelievable what all of you write.It's very clear, there re 2 quilty parties. First of all Rav Tendler, and second of all, the woman.The Rav should step down, no one can stay in such a position with what he did.And of course, you people should move to Israel, instead of staying in America.Many people say that the "chinuch" in Israel is very bad. But at the moment I'm even more convinced that over there it's to cry about.Live the life of a Jew and make Aliyah. No one says it's a easy thing to do, but it makes your life richer.Never forget that making Aliyah and settling the Land (prefarably in the Shomrom or Gaza) is one of the Mitzvot evryone in the Galut seems to forget about.
KNH is polarized. People may want to leave but are intimidated into staying. At least one person has been blackmailed into staying...he was threatened that if he left his affair would be made public...all in all, a sad sorry state for a shul to be in. How did it happen? It was not the "midwive's" fault.
"My skin crawls at the thought of thes harlots being permitted into shul. They have admitted to adultry."Please clarify: Are you saying that these women committed adultery with other men, or with Rabbi Tendler.At the moment, the shul is focused on the situation with Rabbi Tendler. If you claim that there are women in the shul who had affairs with other men, then I would agree that it is disconcerting. However, at the moment the shul is focused on the truth regarding Rabbi Tendler.
"People may want to leave but are intimidated into staying."Your comments are laughable. The people who wanted to leave already left (and no one managed to intimidate them to stay). Unfortunately, some of them were very important members of the kehillah. No one tried to intimidate them or anyone else. KNH is a shul, not a mafia family.
To clarify" RMT has been accused by women of having long term affairs with them -- while he is entitled to the legal process until either proven guilty or admitting guilt, these sluts have admitted to acts requiring cherem. They cannot get a free pass simply because RMT denies it. They must be removed at once.And NO ONE has stronger credentials at KNH than my husband and me. Make sure the door hits your rear end on the way out, slut. Don;t ever set foot in here again, because we aren't going anywhere -- no matter if Tendler is rabbi or not. Who cares anymore?These harlots announced to all they slept with a girlfriends husband repeatedly (and some rather kinky) and then act surprise when its time to pay the piper? Now they are hiding behind Tendler's denial???? Wow. My head is spinning at that one.Into cherem, sluts.
You are not answering the question: Are you saying that Rabbi Tendler had affiars with the women you mention? Yes or No.Based on your choice of words, it sounds like you are saying that those women had affairs with OTHER men, but are using Rabbi Tendler's current situation to hide their own affairs somehow.You and your husband are F.F.B. (Frum From Birth), and you can be reached by dialing 911, although neither of you are a firefighter or policeman. I can't be more oblique than that.
Yes, it is true. People who want to leave are afraid to leave. Afraid of what the Tendler goons might do to them or their family members. Afraid of being alienated from their friends who stay. Afraid of being branded the "enemy" by the Tendler supporters. Yes, a person who was anti-Tendler was intimidated into staying...taken behind closed doors by Esformes and when he emerged from the famous office, lo and behold he was no pro-Tendler. Yes, quite clearly, people are being intimidated into staying!!!! There is fear in New Hempstead!!!!!
Esformes showed his face in KNH for 1 time in the last 10 years, and suddenly he is able to intimidate people? Hard to believe, but sad if true.
If someone admits to a crime, it is not relevant that the purported partner in crime still denies the fact. The admitting party stands guilty by their own word, and punishment commences. The other party is entitled to deny and undergo legal process.These harlots have admitted to affairs, have publicly and repeatedly held their sexual activities up to the world in celebration. They belong in cherem immediately.Sorry not to focus on RMT, but you cannot hide thes women in OUR shul anymore. They have openly claimed to have slept with a girlfriend's husband --his denial does not alter their admission or required punishment.Is that clear enough; I hate being oblique. You sure like my money when its time for donations. Now my money is going to do some talking around here, along with the other TRUE members of KNH, not some anonymous opinion from California or Israel.Adulteress Whores -- out of KNH!
"Afraid of what the Tendler goons might do to them or their family members."What have the Tendler "goons" done to the families that already left? I am friends with many of them, and none of them have mentioned anything.You have an interesting theory, but it simply does not hold up to the facts.
Your unwillingness to answer a point-blank Yes/No quesion is very telling. You repeatedly refer to the adulterer involved as "a girlfriend's husband" rather than as Rabbi Tendler. Thank you for confirming that the women you refer to do not claim to have had affairs with Rabbi Tendler.There is a minyan on your block that started a few months back. Perhaps you should take your money there (along with your vulgarity).
Yes,I believe he is totally innocent and according to the laws of the Chofetz Chaim,you should also.The fact that some foolish women admit to their guilt,well that should be the discussion,as a person is believed on himself more then 100 witnesses. I also believe ,someone should find out who JWB and sue him in either a Beis Din or civil court for all the lies posted.
I am explicitly referring to the adultresses who claim to have had affairs with RMT. They slept with their girlfriend's husband by their own claim, and must be treated as the sluts that they are and banned into cherem forever from the shul and community.If someone admits to a crime, and then claims to have had an accomplice, the purported accomplice is entitled to legal process if he denies it --but the admitting party goes straight to punishment.These women have flaunted open affairs within the community with a girlfriend's (Michelle) husband. While RMT is entitled to due process, these women are now trying to backpeddle on what they said previsouly? Into cherem with the adulteress sluts!When you want major donations for the shul you come knocking. Let's not be oblique, as you said. It's time to put my money to work within KNH and not permit someone in California or Manhattan to dictate proper policy in OUR shul.Make sure the door hits you on thw way out, pal.
"I am explicitly referring to the adultresses who claim to have had affairs with RMT. They slept with their girlfriend's husband by their own claim."Thank you for getting to the point. It was confusing that you referred to Michelle as "their girlfriend" and RMT as "their girlfriend's husband", rather than using their names directly.Please bring your proof to the board and we will thank you. As stated, all KNH wants is the truth. The members believe that RMT is innocent because there is no proof otherwise. Please don't discount the fact that some people might claim to have had an affair with RMT in an attempt to get attention or to make themselves seem important. This is why the board needs facts rather than rumors."someone in California or Manhattan to dictate proper policy in OUR shul"I have no idea who you are referring to in California or Manhattan. I agree that only the shul participants and board should be making decisions that impact the shul."When you want major donations for the shul you come knocking."Your previous donations are appreciated, and any future donations are appreciated too. However, your donations don't buy you the right to dictate policy or terminate anyone's membership. As I said, the shul members and board collectively should decide shul policy based on facts presented to the board.
First, there is no reason to bring proof of anything relating to RMT to the board --he is not the topic.The ONLY topic is what do we do with women who have openly stated that they are having extramarital affairs,and then having the RCA and Israeli rabbis concur. At that point, they must be placed in cherem at once.It makes my wife's skin crawl to think of them in shul on Pesach.I remain completely neutral regarding RMT, as he is entitled to legal process. Not so someone who openly announces she has violated the most basic halachos.
I would like to know what kind of kinky stuff they claims they did .
>regarding RMT, as he is entitled >to legal processSo? Let him sue his alleged victims and the RCA in civil court?While he's at it let him waive confidentiality on the 100k payoff to silence one victim.
"If someone admits to a crime, and then claims to have had an accomplice, the purported accomplice is entitled to legal process if he denies it --but the admitting party goes straight to punishment."Really - is this stated in the Gemara? shulchan oruch? - actually the woman would not be believed and told to bring proof of their claims - and if their husbands did not believe them - their claims would not even effect their marriage. Try and separate your feelings and Halacha - it amazes me that you believe these women are guilty - yet RMT is innocent. Of course technically you realize if they speak the truth he is also guilty as sin.
Many posts in this thread claim that technically speaking, RMT still has a recourse with the chalatah- the RCA decision affected his employment, so the Beis din should tell the RCA to go to a Beis din or ZaBL"A (zeh borer lo echad), which would be a guaranteed victory for RMT. However, while they were technically correct in their language parsing, they missed the words between the lines, IMO. The beis din spends much of the hachlatah apologizing to the RCA, and then says " If, according to your opinion, you are not affecting his rulership, we haven't said anything". The clear indication is that they defer to the RCA on this matter, and don't want to be seen as disrespecting the RCA. As long as the RCA can say with a straight face that they meant this as an internal matter, the beis din won't interfere. If YU fires RMT, that's their problem. They'll say it's based on the RCA, who will in turn say they meant this as an internal matter, creating a classic "zeel hacha kamadchi ley", ie, a halachic "monkey in the middle" with the RMT camp the poor monkey.
The following is from the Jewish Survivors of Sexual Violence Speak Out Blog. I thought it was appropriate to post here since this blog has the same spammer.Thank you Mr. Spammer Man!http://jewishsurvivors.blogspot.com/I want to thank the person who keeps posting the U.S. Constitution to our blog. If it wasn't for that individual I wouldn't know that anyone was reading what is published here. Not only is someone reading it, but they are taking the time out to harass it. I really feel honored that you seem to feel threaten by what we write.When you are attempting to make a difference in the world (in this case give survivors of sexual violence a place to talk), and no one harasses you, you have to stop and wonder if your doing your job well?We all should feel honored that our voices are so threatening to at least one individual that they have the need to harass us. Each and every time they post the constitution to this blog I am reminded of how important this blog is. Thank you for helping me know I'm doing the right thing by keeping this blog going.From a marketing perspective when someone comes to the blog and sees that there are 20 - 30 comments to each posting. It makes it appear like we are extremely popular. Then when you read the postings are mostly from a spammer, you have to really read the content of the blog.Our spammer is helping the world to see how important it is to give survivors of sexual violence an outlet to speak out. You are providing the evidence we needed, that our voices are have not been heard in the past, and one of the reasons was because we where threatened into silence. It's not going to work anymore.
"First, there is no reason to bring proof of anything relating to RMT to the board --he is not the topic."WHAT?? HE IS THE ONLY TOPIC- the issue is whether or not he is fit to be a arbbi (any Rav who is honest and unintimidated will answer say no to that one (I speak form much experience)!!!"The ONLY topic is what do we do with women who have openly stated that they are having extramarital affairs,and then having the RCA and Israeli rabbis concur. At that point, they must be placed in cherem at once."WHo SAYS? BASED ON WHAT HALACHAH?? they are not even believed with regard to themselves halachikally; if anything ONLY with respect to MT according to halachah(- boy do you have this one backwards- what a suprize!)"It makes my wife's skin crawl to think of them in shul on Pesach."It makes mine crawl to have tendler- who has at the very least publicly flaunted laws of yichud,lied publically about many things and ruined so many lives whenever someone has pointed out his flaws - parade as Rabbi in KNH!!! "I remain completely neutral regarding RMT, as he is entitled to legal process. Not so someone who openly announces she has violated the most basic halachos."WHat a bunch of nonesense! This isn't Torah, halachah or truth- all of which I (as opposed to tendler) care very much about!
a JOKE FOR CHOL HAMOED:tendler to board: all those that agree with me say "yes"... ok, good. Now, all those who disagree say "I resign".gutten moed folks!
a better JOKE FOR CHOL HAMOED:midwives to expectant mother: you want us to deliver your baby in your home? then lie about Tendler for us... ok, good.Now, all those who disagree say "OBGYN".gutten moed folks!
At 10:26 AM, Anonymous said... "......... Yes, a person who was anti-Tendler was intimidated into staying...taken behind closed doors by Esformes and when he emerged from the famous office, lo and behold he was no pro-Tendler. Yes, quite clearly, people are being intimidated into staying!!!! There is fear in New Hempstead!!!!!"I'm not even sure when this post was made, but since I recently read what was written above I wanted to set the record straight in response to the post. Since I, Fred B, was the one that Rabbi Esformes asked to speak to privately, not "taken behind closed doors", and at my suggestion we went into Rabbi Tendler's office, let me state for the record that Rabbi Esformes never attempted to intimidate me in any way during our conversation nor did he threaten me, etc. He was simply questioning the reason's for my position and what others felt about the situation. He was respectful and quite concerned over what was going on at KNH. My decision and reversal of opinion on the matter came as a result of my conversation with both Michelle and Rabbi Tendler after the Shul meeting in their home. I realized, just as many others have come to realize, that the Tendler's are being erroneously maligned and that Rabbi Tendler deserves his kehilla's and friend's support. time. No one is attempting to intimidate anyone at KNH. I would hope that everyone who is in some way connected to this matter are continuing to seek the truth and not the sheker and other distorted comments that are overwhelmingly written on JWB's blog site.
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